Mary Hart Perry on What Makes a Hero....Heroic?

by Mary Jo

I’m delighted to welcome back author Kathryn Johnson, today in her guise as Mary Hart Perry, author of romantic Victorian thrillers based on the real lives of Queen Victoria’s daughters.  Wench Susan interviewed her about the first Mary Hart Perry book, The Wild Princess, which featured the rebellious Princess Louise.

Now the second book, Seducing the Princess, features Victoria’s youngest daughter, Princess Beatrice, and the book has Mary Hart Perry pondering what makes heroes heroic.  Her thoughts:

Mary Hart Perry

I've been giving this question a great deal of thought lately. Some writers admit that they model all of their heroes after a single image in their minds--the "perfect" man. But perfection is in the eye of the beholder, is it not? What may seem ideal to one woman, may be totally unappealing to another.

I'm discovering this is true even as I work my way through the third book in my series of romantic Victorian thrillers based on the lives of Queen Victoria's daughters. The second novel (Seducing the Princess) has just been published, and the first (The Wild Princess) came out last fall. In the third, my hero is unlike either of the other two men who woo Princesses Beatrice and Louise. And yet they share certain characteristics that appeal to me and, I hope, to my readers.

For me, the ideal hero is a blend of characteristics. First, he must be intelligent. Yup, that's right. I'm likely to pass by a guy who's so fantastic looking that women get whiplash when he passes through a room. I've learned that guys who depend upon their hunkiness to get women usually are all too aware of their looks and expect us to fall at their feet. Something inside me rebels at that. I want to be thought of as special, not just another fling. So if he's got brains and he can hold up his end of an interesting conversation, I'm likely to hang around for a while. That's what I like about Henry in Seducing the Princess. He's a clever guy, and he uses his head to win the woman of his dreams. But neither is he squeamish about taking on his enemy in a physical way, to protect Bea.

I'll give you an example from real life that I've never told anyone before. When I was much younger, I had an immense crush on political pundit, George Will. (Don't laugh!) Seriously. I know he wasn't cover model gorgeous. With his nappy college-prof jackets and horn-rimmed glasses and conservative haircuts, he didn't look like a beefed-up romance hero. But I could listen to that man forever! Because, while he spoke, there was that mysterious, playful twinkle in his eyes that made me suspect he was a lot more fun than he wanted to let on to the world. (Like in bed?) Was he saving that fun for a special lady? I imagined it might be (gulp)...me!

So brains turn me on, and I'll bet they throw the switch for other women, too.

What else? Okay, to be honest--money. Or, at least, the lack of a need for me to have money. My fantasy lover is so smart, he's made his million by the time he turned 25...or at least before we met. And he's generous with his fortune. He would be thrilled to take me on a whirlwind tour of Europe or invite me to cruise with him on his yacht in the Virgin Islands. I suppose this is a natural, given today's economy. We all are super-conscious about our budgets. But wouldn't it be lover-ly (as Eliza Doolittle sings in My Fair Lady) to have someone provide for us whatever we need or want--food, clothing, jewelry, travel...?  So my heroes are likely not to have money problems and will never beg for loans from my heroines. In Seducing, my hero is one of four brothers and a prince in his own right. He isn't ostentatiously wealthy, and actually his family is less well off than the queen and her family. But it's pretty clear that he will always have enough cash on hand to take care of his beloved and, perhaps, afford the occasional yachting adventure or diamond bracelet.

The third trait I find necessary for my heroes is that they are nice guys. Truly. If they have a bad-boy image, it's because no one really understands them, or they have cultivated that image for a purpose. A guy who's cruel, arrogant, pushy, selfish, prone to jealousy or needs to always be the boss to be happy...he's not one of my heroes. In The Wild Princess, the hero seems at first self-important and aloof, but there's a good reason for the way he is. And eventually Princess Louise discovers how to break through that barrier. Besides being quite a good guy in many other ways, he's physically very impressive and darn good at saving lives.

Finally--oh, all right, I give up--there's the way he looks. So it's not at the top of my list but appearance still matters. The difference is, perfection still doesn't appeal to me. My ideal hero will have one or more striking aspects--tall, muscled, a super dresser, whatever--but he's not rock-star gorgeous and may well have flaws that would make him less attractive to other women. In a word, he's unique.

The hero I'm developing for my third book in the Victorian series isn't wealthy, titled, or a hunk in the traditional sense. But he's dedicated, aggressive when it comes to doing his job (tracking down a notorious murderer of women), and he "gets" the heroine. Whereas others don't understand her and can only feel sorry for her, thinking she has no future--he recognizes her talents, intelligence, and beauty.  And he's smitten.

MJP: Which princess is the heroine of the third book?  Inquiring minds want to know!

MHP:  In Book 3 of the series, Crown Princess Vickie returns to London at the urgent request of her niece, Princess Maud, whose brother has just been accused of being the infamous serial killer, Jack the Ripper.

So there you have it. Heroes--at least the way I look at them.

I'd love to hear your favorite 3 or 4 traits for your fictional (or real-life) heroes. Come on...give it a go! 

Hugs, Mary Hart Perry

Thanks, Mary/Kathryn!  Book 3 sounds like another great story.  Isn't it fortunate that Queen Victoria had such a passel of daughters for you to work with?!!  Here are some excerpts of Seducing the Princess if you'd like a taste!

Mary Jo, adding that the bride above is Princess Beatrice in her gorgeous wedding gown

 

Comments

[HJ]

Mary/Kathryn - sorry, this is off-topic in that it isn't answering the question you posed. I don't normally read books set in the Victorian period so I haven't come across yours before and I apologise if this is obvious to everyone else! My question is: given that you're writing about real people (the daughters of Queen Victoria) how are you able to dream up heroes for them? Don't we know who they loved and/or married?

Or do you just use the princesses as your starting point, and create entirely imaginary stories for them? In that case, do you also imagine what the princesses were like, or do you use what is known about their personalities and work from there?

I really like your analysis of the important traits of a hero. I agree with them!

[Donna]

First of all, I was delighted to read that the second book in this series had been published. I clicked the link and bought it before even continuing the interview!

I have to say that I agree - for the most part - with your hero's list of traits. I too would list intelligence at the top of the list. Kind, considerate and nice would also be at the top. You didn't list humor and that is very important to me (I have four brothers!).

The one trait that I have a slight quibble with is money. No, I don't want my hero to be on food stamps, but comfortable is enough. After all, an intelligent man has figured out how to support himself. My prejudice against stacks of money comes from having spent my career in the Thoroughbred racing industry and having known extremely rich men. They are Not. Nice. People.

Great to "see" you back here!

[Mary Hart Perry]

Donna, really...when it comes down to it, you're absolutely right. All I need is "comfortable". I don't need a palace, and in reality never will have a palace. But it's a fantasy that some of us allow ourselves--the never having to worry about money again. And thank you so much for picking up the new book. It's the support of wonderful readers like you that keeps us authors writing and knowing we're appreciated. Hugs! MHP

[Mary Hart Perry]

HJ--What good questions you've come up with! Love it. Okay, so the truth is, sometimes I use the real people/heroes in a heroine's life. And sometimes I need to create a hero that they deserve, or I feel they deserve. In the case of Beatrice, the youngest daughter, it was easy because she really did marry Henry Battenberg. And he really did have to struggle to win her hand and to win the queen's approval. So that part of the story is true. But I needed a villain, and so I created the Scot and the plot to infiltrate the family and Court by wooing Beatrice. In the earlier book, Louise's hero is fiction. But a great deal is rumored about her and her marriage to Lorne. It was thought he was gay, which would have dictated that their marriage was without sexual gratification for her--and that's somewhat supported by the fact that she never had children...at least so far as the records show. There were rumors or a possible affair or affairs, and other gossip as well about her youth and teen years. That's where I feel intrigued enough to come up with fictional elements...and supply her with a hero. Hope you enjoy the stories if you get a chance to read them! All my best, MHP

[Willa Blair]

I love this series. Book 3 sounds fabulous! I can't wait.

As for hero's traits, if women judged solely on looks, there'd be a lot of men who would never pair up. We are drawn to brains, personality, but above all, I think, a man who cares about us and treats us like a princess. Okay, maybe not like a princess - that is a bit over the top. But really well.

I love it when my husband indulges me. I'll bet you do, too.

[Elizabeth Ashtree]

Love your books, Mary! You have a wonderful "voice" and I am hoping for continued success so there will be many more Princess books in the futureM

[Patricia Rice]

Welcome, Mary Hart Perry/Kathryn! I'll agree on brains over looks every time, although we really need to find physical attraction of some sort. But a man who is willing to work hard to get what he wants and has the intelligence to accomplish it is worth all the money in the world!

[Mary Hart Perry]

Willa, Elizabeth, and Patricia...thanks so much for your comments! Why weren't we this smart when we were in our 20's? LOL! At least, that applies to me. I see a lot of younger women, myself included, who made choices based merely on looks or sexual attraction and later regretted it. For some of us, it takes longer to "wise up" and look for the important character traits in a man.

[jamie beck]

I totally agree with this list of qualities. Uniqueness, intelligence, and kindness...must haves! You forgot one other quality, though, that I would include. A compatible sense of humor. He doesn't have to be hilarious, but it is good when he shares a similar sense of humor with the heroine. In fact, for me, a good sense of humor will cover a multitude of sins...LOL.

In my 20s I had a very specific list of qualities I was looking for (which is, in itself, quite hilarious). My boss asked me about it once. He became appalled at its specificity and told me I'd never find that guy. He was right! Older and wiser women finally understand what is important in our heroes!

[jamie beck]

I totally agree with this list of qualities. Uniqueness, intelligence, and kindness...must haves! You forgot one other quality, though, that I would include. A compatible sense of humor. He doesn't have to be hilarious, but it is good when he shares a similar sense of humor with the heroine. In fact, for me, a good sense of humor will cover a multitude of sins...LOL.

In my 20s I had a very specific list of qualities I was looking for (which is, in itself, quite hilarious). My boss asked me about it once. He became appalled at its specificity and told me I'd never find that guy. He was right! Older and wiser women finally understand what is important in our heroes!

[Jo Beverley]

Hi Mary/Kathryn, I agree with your list of qualities, too. But I have to add chemistry.

And IMO, chemistry trumps all, which is why people sometimes love and marry the weirdest people. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

The trick in a novel, of course, is to get the reader to buy into the wild chemical attraction if the hero seems lacking in some areas of the list!

IMO, that is,

Jo

[Mary Hart Perry]

Hi, Jamie and Jo! Thanks for your thoughts. Yes, chemistry. Love that chemistry. I will never forget the first moment I laid eyes on my husband to be. We both happened to be at a ballroom dance class and had never met. I was about to leave because I didn't know anyone there and I seemed not to be hitting it off with anyone, and the music wasn't that great...so I was on my way toward the door and home. And I saw this man walking across the ballroom floor toward me. Looking straight at me and nowhere else. Six feet tall. A smile as wide as Texas. And the bluest eyes this brown-eyed girl. Pow! And I thought to myself, "Now, lady, you're really in trouble." Because he just looked like a heart breaker. But he turned out to be the sweetest guy ever. Chemistry.

[Mary Jo Putney]

Mary/Kathryn--

What a wonderfully romantic story! He saw you a cross a crowded room.....

Yep, chemistry and humor and priceless parts of the formula.

[Sherrie Holmes]

Sherrie, here. Oh, what a delectable subject! I'd have to say that intelligence is probably tops on my list for a hero. Next, as Jo Beverley mentioned, is chemistry. I'm not so concerned about looks, because I have found that if the guy is intelligent and the chemistry is right, looks don't matter, and in fact he *becomes* attractive in my eyes. Side note: I was once engaged to a drop dead gorgeous guy: 6'4", killer smile, sexy as all get-out, double degrees--a veterinarian AND a lawyer, smart as a whip. And narcissistic. Oh my. I'm glad we never married.

I have the published diary of a pioneer woman who kept a journal as she and her parents crossed the prairies in a covered wagon during the expansion of the American West. A single lady and her brother were also making the trek, and this diary keeper wrote (a bit jealously) that the single lady was quite homely, yet she was so lively and so much fun that every evening all the unmarried young bucks fluttered over to her campfire like moths to a flame.

Like you, Mary/Kathryn, I prefer heroes who are flawed. Perfection is boring. Flawed heroes are so much more interesting!

[Nicola Cornick]

Fabulous interview. Thank you Mary Hart Perry/Kathryn and Mary Jo. I can't wait to pick up the books. I totally agree on the intelligence. It's top of my list too. I can find the most unlikely guys fascinating if their conversation intrigues me. A colleague of mine when I worked in universities used to call it mind meld which I believe she borrowed from Star Trek!

Kindness, generosity of spirit, a good sense of humour, integrity and resourcefulness are also on my list.

Ah, the chemistry. When I first met my husband we were at a college reception and I could feel someone looking at me. I turned around and saw him and thought "uh oh!" because even on the basis of 10 seconds acquaintance I knew this was going to be serious and I wasn't ready for serious. It worked out in the end though!

[Mary Jo Putney]

Nicola--

Your experience, not to mention Mary Hart Perry's, is what works so very well in our romances! Because the instant electric attraction really can happen.

[Jorie]

Good afternoon, Ms. Perry & Ms. Putney! :)

I adore the depth of intrique and how fully realised your characters have become as the series progresses! :) I was curious, has adding in the element of Jack the Ripper changed in your preception of whom we always thought it was compared to who it turned out to being, now that the case was finally resolved!? I was curious how authors were going to deal with that, as its such an auspicious ending to such a horrid event in history!

My favourite traits in a hero are rooted in my observations of the men in my own family,... including ancestral, as I enjoy digging into our past through genealogy -- men of strength of character as much as advocacy of the rights of others, who applaud a women's right to have her own voice in all affairs, take charge individuals who yield when they're in the thick of something they don't know, but are ready to aid in something they can contribute too,... kind, sensitive, yet not in a bashful way, who take the time to present themselves well to society, but care more about hearth, home, and family rather than egocentric ideals. And, humour to encourage the lighter side of life whilst walking through the harried days of strife, inasmuch as celebrating the joys!

It's a curious question for sure! And, one that has a lot depth to respond too!

[Mary Hart Perry]

Jorie, I was intrigued by your comment: "now that the case was finally resolved"--that is, the question of Jack the Ripper's identity. I've done a lot of research and read many different theories, but so far I haven't seen a definitive answer to who he was. No solid evidence. Can you tell me your source? I have my own theory, but want to make sure I haven't overlooked new facts that are well supported. Thanks for letting me know! MHP

[Mary Hart Perry]

All right...Jorie and I have now had a chat, off-blog. And here's what we figured out. A couple of years ago, she saw the documentary on TV with Patricia Cornwall and others theorizing about Jack the Ripper. Because the show was so convincing, she thought it was a closed case. Not so, say many others who have studied the Ripper cases for years. There are still so many unproven statements, conflicting theories and clues that most experts on the 19th-century serial killer admit we'll probably never know who he/she was. And that's what's making writing a book about this subject so exciting. I love to look for the little holes in history, and then fit a plot and characters into that space in time. Thanks, Jorie, for getting back to me with your explanation! Mary Hart Perry

[Mary Jo Putney]

MHP--I wondered if it might be Cornwell's confidence that made it seem like the Ripper was "case closed," but I have a friend who is a Ripper buff who read Cornwell's book and promptly told me it was just another set of opinions. I'm not a Ripper buff, so I just watch from the sidelines!